OVWP Interview 24 “The Veteran” Jack Vaughn: *THIGH SLAP*
You are listening to the OVW podcast. It's, for legal purposes. The unofficial OVW podcast, just so we're clear. Welcome to the OVW Podcast, the unofficial podcast of Ohio Valley Wrestling. It's a Thursday in the future.
Jackman Ochs:You know what that means? My name is Jack. I'm joined today as always by Brian Irons.
Brian Hines:Hey. Hey, Jack.
Jackman Ochs:Man. And since it's a Thursday, we have a very special guest, the veteran, the last real professional wrestler, Jack Vaughn.
Jack Vaughn:Mick Foley's
Jackman Ochs:Mick Foley. Wrestler.
Brian Hines:Yes. Don't forget that.
Jackman Ochs:Mick missus Foley's baby boy's favorite wrestler.
Jack Vaughn:Yes. That's what I tried to say, and I realized I messed it up.
Jackman Ochs:What was man, you get a huge compliment from like that from a guy like that. Mhmm. Well, we'll just start there. No better place to start. Mick Foley comes out on international television and says, Jack Von is my new favorite professional wrestler.
Jackman Ochs:What is that like? How does that make you feel, Jack Von?
Jack Vaughn:That's one of those, is this real life kind of moments. Yeah. Because obviously I grew up watching Mick and I I very, you know, we talk about like the King of the Ring match, the Hell in a Cell. Like, I just have very vivid memories of watching that with my dad and just growing up, you know, loving everything that Mick did as Mankind. And to just, first of all, just meeting him for the first time
Brian Hines:was awesome.
Jack Vaughn:But then to have him like, because I didn't know what he was saying when I was because that was during the the the Rumble match. And as I'm walking back through the curtain, he's like, Jack, Jack, come over here. Let me get your autograph. And I'm like, what is happening? And then everyone was just like, yeah, Mick was just raving about you.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Wow. I'm like, that is, like, that is so cool.
Jackman Ochs:If if I could ask, what was there anything specific he said about you or just great job?
Jack Vaughn:Oh, I mean
Jackman Ochs:Have a nice day.
Jack Vaughn:Just, like, while I was in the match, you just kept saying, like, you know, this guy's my new favorite wrestler. Mhmm. And, no. He just he loves the look, and I I think it's he he likes to put over the mustache.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah. Sure. So It's a great mustache. Yeah. Yeah.
Jackman Ochs:Fantastic. I've been trying to grow this for, like, 2 months. This is all I got. I have mustache envy.
Jack Vaughn:See, I can't I can't grow it up here anymore, so I gotta compensate.
Jackman Ochs:Gotta get it right. Right. Do you you kind of fashion yourself over, very plainly as, like, an old school wrestler. You're wearing a Terry Funk shirt right now. You're right.
Jackman Ochs:What is it about you mentioned Mick Foley. You're watching during the Attitude Era, then you start wrestling. What is it about that generation maybe 2, 3 generations before the attitude generation, attitude era that attracts you so much to that that era of wrestling?
Jack Vaughn:I think it's one of those things where it's the wrestling that I watched growing up. Mhmm. And I think, you know, it's kinda like how the bands that you loved growing up, you love them when you get older. Yeah. You know, it's it's similar to that with wrestling.
Jack Vaughn:It's like I grew up watching Macho Man and Undertaker and and, like, the early like, the late eighties, early nineties, WWF and WCW. And that's just always the stuff that I gravitated towards. So when I got into wrestling, that that, style was still the pocketbook style, you know, very storytelling based, psychology based. It had started to kinda get more towards the indie thing because Ring of Honor had just started. And Ring of Honor, I loved Ring of Honor back when it first started.
Jack Vaughn:It was still very like, you know, heavily story based but it's just like it's kind of progressed and I think Ring of Honor was kind of the start of that more athletic Yeah. Like work rate style. But it's just because I I grew up loving those guys and it's just the the wrestling the the style of wrestling that I grew up loving and is the the kind that I was taught.
Jackman Ochs:Can you put into your own words what the difference is between, like, what you do and what indie style wrestling is?
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. I mean, it's pretty simple. I just to me, wrestling is more about the story and the characters rather than the moves and the spots.
Jackman Ochs:Mhmm.
Jack Vaughn:And the indie style is much more of the, you know, we're in the work rate generation. Yeah. And I do love, and I've said this before, like I love the creativity of modern wrestling, but I feel like a lot of times guys sacrifice good storytelling in favor of being creative. Okay. And when that happens, that's when it loses me and that's when I lose interest.
Jackman Ochs:Do you do you you you all you must feel at some point, though, that what you do is creative.
Jack Vaughn:I do think that what I do is create I think what I what I do is creative because people don't do it anymore. Right. And not to say I can't get creative with certain spots, but I try to get creative with the way that I tell the story rather than the moves that I do.
Jackman Ochs:Well, and I think that there's kind of like, an element of you 2 where you acknowledge this other thing going on that you don't do. Mhmm. Is that where the thigh slap came from? Absolutely. What?
Jackman Ochs:Can we delve in a little bit more into that?
Jack Vaughn:Sure. So, so it all kind of started with when I started doing the TikTok videos. Yeah. And that came about because when I started for people that don't know, I haven't always been the veteran. I've been wrestling for a really long time.
Jack Vaughn:I've only I just came up with the veteran in 2020. Okay. And, really, what it was is that I wanted to just be an old school heel. Like, I didn't want anyone to like me. I wanted everyone to just hate my guts.
Jack Vaughn:Kinda like JBL. That's kinda one of the people that I really fashioned myself after. Okay. Because even though if, like, you were smart to the business, you hated JBL because of what he was doing. Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:And that's kind of what I wanted to do. And it was like, well, what's one thing that, like, an old school wrestler wouldn't do? He wouldn't do social media.
Jackman Ochs:Right.
Jack Vaughn:But then it's kind of apparent, like, in this day and age, that's very important if you actually wanna make your name in wrestling. So what happened was I was at a a seminar for a guy by, by the name of Brutal Bob Evans, who's very well known among wrestlers. Mhmm. And he told me he's like, Jack, I really like the way that you do your social media, but I really think you need to do video content because it's so popular right now. And he was like, specifically, I think you should do TikTok.
Jack Vaughn:And I was like, man, like, I really don't want to do TikTok. I I've never, like, I've never even downloaded it. I had no like, I kinda hated it. Yeah. And so I was like, okay.
Jack Vaughn:Fine. I'll I'll I'll see what I can do. And I filmed a couple videos, and they blew up immediately. And in the second video I did, I just did a fake thigh slap because I was just kinda making fun of how guys just slap their thighs every time they do moves and people just loved it. So I kinda I I just started throwing it in every video as like an Easter egg And then now it's at the point where if I don't put one in, I get tons of comments here about it.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Tons of comments like, where was the thigh slot?
Jackman Ochs:They're only looking they're there for the
Jack Vaughn:thigh slot. They're they're specifically looking for it.
Jackman Ochs:Did you think that, like, there's, like, honestly kind of something, though, about the way that TikTok is set up that where it does give you that, consistent kind of, you know, the the good good thoughts and feelings
Jack Vaughn:Mhmm.
Jackman Ochs:That, like, something that's very set set up the way that wrestling fans are set up is, like, we're used to call and response. We're used to, repetition. We're used to so, like, whenever you leave the thigh slap out of a TikTok, that's the only thing people notice.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. I think for sure.
Jackman Ochs:I think that there's a weird thing about TikTok and wrestling fans where it is actually just, like, set up perfectly for the way that wrestling fans view content.
Jack Vaughn:It it would be like if you went to a wrestling show with The Rock and he didn't do the people's elbow. Right. You'd be like, well, he he didn't do the people's elbow. Yeah. That sort of thing.
Brian Hines:Or you you go to a concert and you don't get the greatest hit. Exactly.
Jackman Ochs:Or you go to see Guns N' Roses in there on time. You know? And and you yeah. And when you're not getting the thing that you're used to, you know, your automatic response as a fan is to say, wait. Wait.
Jackman Ochs:Wait. Wait. Wait. No. I want that.
Jackman Ochs:I want that. Yeah. And then you've you found this thing kind of landed in your thighs to to to put put it literally.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. It's crazy how it happened. Like, it because I did it as a joke to make fun of it. Yeah. And now it's the thing that everyone wants me to do myself.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah. And you've even on this podcast feed, you can find it in this feed, guys like Will Austin Mhmm. That you're kind of taking a shot out there. Sure. Still love it.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah. And and it makes guys like that wanna work with you even more because, you know, it's it's obvious maybe they wanna prove something to you or they wanna prove something to the fans. Like, I can go I can go with this guy.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. And I've always prided myself on the fact that I believe that I can have a good match with anybody.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:So, like, even though I don't do that style, I can work a match like that and still keep it very, like, Jack Von centric. You know
Jackman Ochs:what I mean?
Jack Vaughn:Like, I still keep my style. I don't know if you guys are familiar with Ace Perry. He's an I got from Indiana.
Jackman Ochs:I don't
Jack Vaughn:think so. He's very he's very much one of those kind of guys. Yeah. And, I had a match with him, a couple months ago, and it was one of my favorite matches I've had. And it was very much like it was a Jack Von match, but it still had a lot of elements of, like, his super indie stuff.
Jack Vaughn:Right. So yeah. I but, yeah, with, like, Will and stuff, like, he's very good at doing that style, like a lot of guys are. I think the problem with doing the the indie style is that everyone does it now, so it's hard to stand out. And I think that's one thing that separates me is that I'm not doing that.
Jack Vaughn:I do stuff that you haven't seen in 20 years. So it's like what's old is new again.
Jackman Ochs:Right.
Brian Hines:Yeah. It's all come back around full circle. Of all the, all the people in the OVW locker room, I go back with you the longest being that, I've been watching you in Southern Ohio on, the Spot Monkey shows. Mhmm. So long that, I remember when you had hair.
Brian Hines:So I guess my question is, how did you, get into wrestling, and who were you before you became the veteran?
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. So I, you know, grew up just being a huge fan. And when I was in high school, like a lot of people my age, we did backyard wrestling with my buddies in high school. Oh, sure. And That makes
Jackman Ochs:it a little easier to figure out how old you actually have there.
Jack Vaughn:Right. And then when I was just graduating high school, there was an ad in the paper back when newspapers were a thing. Yeah. I remember that.
Jackman Ochs:Now it's real easy to figure out how old you are. Right. Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:But there was an ad in the paper for a wrestling school being run by Sharkboy. Oh, Sharkboy. Yeah. And I I pretty much told a couple of my buddies about it, and we all just signed up. I used my student loan money to pay for for school.
Jackman Ochs:Right on.
Jack Vaughn:And, that's how it started. And then, you know, with Sharkboy, his was more of a camp. It wasn't a school. Mhmm. So it was designed to be a 15 week course that was the purpose was to kinda, like, give you the basics and then you move on to another company to continue your training.
Jack Vaughn:Oh, okay. So I finished with with Shark, and then I started working with, the Northern Wrestling Federation in Cincinnati under, Roger Ruffin.
Jackman Ochs:So you are you central to, Cincinnati area? Okay.
Jack Vaughn:Yep. Yeah. I grew I grew up more towards Dayton, but in terms of, like, if people say, where do you wrestle out of, I just say Cincinnati. That's primarily where I was wrestling from.
Jackman Ochs:There's a Cincinnati is not a bad place to come from if you're trying to, get into the professional wrestling business.
Jack Vaughn:Not at all. And especially, I mean, especially back then because that was shortly after HWA. Mhmm. They were still around, but they they used to be the developmental. Right.
Jack Vaughn:And, I mean, I I look back and, like, when I started, HWA had I mean, it was run being run by Cody Hawk, and then they had BJ Whitmer, Nigel McGuinness, Chad Collier, Matt Striker, and just all these guys that went on to be like Ring of Honor and do all this other stuff. And then at NWF you had Karl Anderson and Abyss had come out of there, Chris Harris had come out of there.
Brian Hines:Oh, wow.
Jack Vaughn:So there was like, Cincinnati was a real hotbed for a long time.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah. Yeah. I was gonna ask if you had any experience with HWA.
Jack Vaughn:No. So it's funny because, it's it's one of the things I joke about with Cody now, but Cody Hawk did not like me when I first started. Okay. Because I originally finished with shark with Sharkboy. I went to HSA, and I couldn't really afford to pay for the school.
Jack Vaughn:Mhmm. So I basically, like, signed the contract to come train with them and then quit, which, understandably, I understand why Cody didn't like me for a long time. Not a
Jackman Ochs:veteran move.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Not a veteran move. That was pre veteran. But, but, no, we're we're cool now, obviously.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:But, but, yeah, that's that's how that started. So I don't I don't really have I never wrestled for on an HWA show, my experience was just kind of knowing the guys there.
Jackman Ochs:Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:And then, just to to answer the previous question, I was known as Muldoon when I was with NWF.
Brian Hines:Oh, really?
Jack Vaughn:And then, when I stopped working with NWF, the last so I I retired in 2013. And the last year or so before I retired, I was Dustin the Dustin Thomas. So I just took my real name and I just ripped off a, a joke from Boy Meets World. And, You got
Jackman Ochs:some weird influences on your wrestling life.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Boy Meets World. I don't I
Jackman Ochs:don't hate it,
Jack Vaughn:man. It's awesome. And then, yeah. And then I I kinda just got to the point it was 2013. I got to the point where I was just kinda really bitter Mhmm.
Jack Vaughn:About wrestling and just kinda sick of it and I quit and I came back and I would do like shows here and there and then it wasn't until 2019 that I decided, you know, I kinda just miss being in wrestling. Yeah. I I, you know, I wasn't wanting to necessarily take it seriously, I just wanted to go back and see my friends and have fun. Sure. And, and then I came up with a veteran, and then things just started kinda blowing up for me.
Jack Vaughn:So
Jackman Ochs:What's, what's it like to come to a place like OVW where you said, hey, I can't afford wrestling school. I use my student loan checks to pay for wrestling school or wrestling camp. Now you're at a place like OVW where there's this whole generation of guys that are breaking in and they're getting student loan money for the specific purpose of coming to OVW. And OVW is like contracted or not contracted, but it's a registered school in the state of Kentucky, a trade school. Like, did you ever think whenever you started wrestling, you're spending your your student loan money that, like, a system like that would ever exist for professional wrestling?
Jack Vaughn:Not at all. That's that's such a cool thing too. I guess the only downside is that even with that is, you know, let's say I use my student loan to pay for wrestling school, I still have to be able to do the thing like I can't just get a good job. I can't I can't just go to the WWE right after that. I have
Brian Hines:to be
Jack Vaughn:good and I have to really like hone my skills. And, whereas, like, if I were to go to, like, a trade school and become a welder, like Yeah. They need welders out there. So you're gonna, you know, go get a job pretty much immediately.
Jackman Ochs:You know what? That's actually an incredible come down to you. Mhmm. But unlike welding or electrician work or anything like that, like a normal trade school and a traditional trade school.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah.
Jackman Ochs:There's no guarantee. Right. Like, they don't use wrestlers to to put Blacktop down.
Brian Hines:Right. Exactly. Yeah. They're not out there, like, building bridges.
Jackman Ochs:And I'm sure there's a lot of wrestlers who have played placed Blacktop.
Jack Vaughn:For sure.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah. Like but it's just like there there really is I had never really thought of it in terms of of that there still is there's still a long way to fall even if you are the best person at OVW, best, you know, best student.
Jack Vaughn:And, I mean, obviously, we you have the best teachers. I mean Right. If you're gonna Oh, absolutely. Pay for if you're gonna pay to go to a wrestling trade school, I mean, who better than Al and Doug Doug Basham and those those kind of guys training you. Guys that have actually been to the top of the business.
Jack Vaughn:But, yeah, it's that that's the one downfall is that, like, there's no guarantee. No matter what level you're on, like, you're there's no guarantee you're gonna be able to support yourself with wrestling.
Jackman Ochs:And then you you've mentioned you retired. You saw it very, very real, very clearly how hard it is to support yourself for wrestling. Here we are 10 years later, little over 10 years later. What's one thing you would go back and say to the 2013 Jack Von Muldoon about staying in professional wrestling? Or did you were you at a point with it where you needed to walk away to realize how much you needed it or wanted it?
Jack Vaughn:I I think I needed to take that time off because I I had just gotten married, like, like, a year prior. Mhmm. And just other things have become more important to
Jackman Ochs:me. Sure.
Jack Vaughn:But I think what I would I would actually go back to, like, when I first started wrestling and say, like because I really felt like I didn't do the things that I needed to do to succeed. Mhmm. Because I didn't really have a mentor. I didn't have someone tell me, hey. You need to get in cars and go ride with guys to shows.
Jack Vaughn:You don't you know, you need to, you know, make yourself available. You need the network. I was content wrestling for the same company every Saturday because it was like, I didn't have to look for bookings. It's always there.
Brian Hines:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:And I didn't have anyone saying, hey, hop in the car with me because all the guys that I knew were on the shows I was on. Yeah. Right. Right. So I I would go back and be like, hey.
Jack Vaughn:Don't get tied down working for 1 company. You know? Get out there. Travel. And even though, like, I love NWF, you know, I love Roger and I love I loved working there, but I feel like I missed out on a lot of the wrestling experience by not getting on the road and sort of having that, like, struggling sort of lifestyle.
Jack Vaughn:You know? Like like a struggling artist.
Jackman Ochs:Right. Right.
Jack Vaughn:Like a musician or something like that.
Jackman Ochs:Do you think that when you came back to wrestling that, like, all of those ideas that you had learned or things that you had thought about, concentrated on your time away from wrestling, do you think that that's, like, where the veteran, like, comes from? Is he's just like, if I'm gonna come back and redo this the way I wanna do it, this is how I wanna do it. I wanna I wanna be this idea of what a professional wrestler is.
Jack Vaughn:So when I first came back, I was still not the veteran. Okay. I was wild thing Jack Vaughn.
Brian Hines:Oh, like the Major League.
Jack Vaughn:Yes. Yeah. So when people are like, oh, are those glasses from was that, like, from the movie? And I'm like
Brian Hines:That makes
Jack Vaughn:yeah. My name's Vaughn. And then they kind of click, so I'm like, oh, okay. Makes sense. But, so when I again, when I first came back, I didn't really I still didn't really have, like, that old school mentality.
Jack Vaughn:I still wrestle like an old school wrestler. Mhmm. But it was still, like, I was start trying to incorporate spots and stuff to kind of appeal to the modern audience. But when I what happened was I was at a show that a bunch of my friends were on. I wasn't even booked.
Jack Vaughn:I was just there to hang out. And, I was talking to Jake Oman. And we were just it was, like, after the show, and I was just like, man. Like, there needs to be just that one guy who's just, like, an old, bitter, grizzled wrestler who just hates everything these young guys are doing. And, as I was driving home, I just I had all these ideas for this character.
Jack Vaughn:And I was like, yeah, man. Someone someone should do that. And then I was like, wait a minute. I should do that. And then I I said out loud, I was like, the veteran Jack Vaughn, and then it just kinda clicked.
Jack Vaughn:Mhmm. And then I was like, okay. That's what I'm doing now. That's that's the new thing.
Jackman Ochs:That's it. So we become the veteran. Mhmm. We've retired. We've come back.
Jackman Ochs:We become the veteran. We end up at OVW very quickly into coming into OVW. You're you're up there. You're rubbing shoulders with the biggest and best guys that they have. Was there ever a moment where you looked at that and said, wow.
Jackman Ochs:I'm so glad I didn't stay retired? Well,
Jack Vaughn:I'm Yeah. I mean, for sure. I I didn't expect to get that push when I first came in. Mhmm. But I think it's it's obviously, it's a huge honor to have Al believe in you to that point.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Certainly. To be like, oh, well, you know, we're gonna put you in there with our top guys.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:Because I look back at when I first came to OVW, and I feel like even then, I feel like I've improved so much just because working television is so much different than working on, like, an independent stage.
Jackman Ochs:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:You know? Just having, like, know what the cameras are at all times and facial expressions and stuff like that. And and then, you know, as as someone who comes to, like, the Spot Monkey shows
Brian Hines:Yeah.
Jack Vaughn:Then you're more familiar with, like, the independent stuff, you can't miss your times. No. You you gotta make sure that you're on time. Yeah. Because I don't wanna be there for 4 and a half hours.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. It's a tight one schedule. Right. But no. But, yeah, it just it was it was a huge, like, confidence boost for me because I was kind of, I've been doing well on the independents, but OVW is a whole different beast than what I was used to.
Jack Vaughn:So just to have that that, you know, to get that stamp of approval from guys like Al and everybody else was was huge for me.
Jackman Ochs:So you come back, you get this huge stamp of approval, and then the whole the whole thing catches fire. Right? And you are you are still so integral into these stories that are being told to a whole brand new audience. Is that a lot of weight on your shoulders?
Jack Vaughn:I think for some people, it would be, but I I'm confident enough in my ability to where it doesn't really bother me. And it seems like I actually kinda welcome it.
Jackman Ochs:Sure. Sure. And I mean, you've done you've done you've plugged away a lot in the past, and it does seem like you're a very thoughtful, smart guy. It does seem like you appreciate a new challenge.
Jack Vaughn:Mhmm.
Jackman Ochs:And OVW is in a place right now where there's a lot of new challenges, I feel like. And that's a good thing to have. That's a really good thing to have. Can you just name me some of your accomplishments at OVW, please?
Jack Vaughn:2 time Kentucky heavyweight champion k. And 3 time OVW heavyweight champion. And how long were
Jackman Ochs:you in the company before you got championship gold? 2 weeks. That's a huge huge vote of confidence. That's all you need. These are guys that you grew up watching on television.
Jackman Ochs:You retired. You came back. Mhmm. Championship goal 2 weeks in. Man, what, as a fan, that's almost like something if I saw in a book or a movie, I wouldn't believe it.
Jackman Ochs:Right. And And you're living it.
Jack Vaughn:Mhmm. Are you glad? You glad you came back? I I think, it was I think it was a good move. I think, it's it's worked out well for me.
Jack Vaughn:And, you know, I I when I first came back, I wasn't expecting stuff like this. I kinda just wanted to be back in the business and see my friends. But, you know, when it was like when that happened, I started to realize, you know, maybe I do have something here. Like, maybe I do have here. Like, maybe I do have a chance.
Jack Vaughn:Granted, I'm a little older, so maybe, like, the big companies like WWE maybe aren't interested in someone my age, but, like, I still feel like I have a lot of good years left because I I don't work that high impact style. Like, my body still feels good. I still feel like I can contribute. So, but, yeah, I think, coming to wrestling and and just just for, like, for the it's the sport that I love and something that I've loved my entire life. So, like, the years that I spent away from it, it it was like something was missing.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. Like, even though I kinda kept track of it and lived vicariously through some of my friends, it's just it's not the same as being able to get into a locker room and feeling that rush when you come through the curtain.
Jackman Ochs:Absolutely. On the way out here, can you plug your social medias including that very famous TikTok?
Jack Vaughn:Of course. So pretty much all social media, Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok is vetjackvon. K. And then Facebook is veteran Jack Vaughn. I also have a YouTube channel.
Jack Vaughn:I don't post on it as much as those are mostly for matches.
Jackman Ochs:Okay. Oh, okay. Cool.
Jack Vaughn:Yeah. But, that's just veteran Jack Vaughn on YouTube.
Jackman Ochs:And so I'll say this. If you've never watched the Jack Von match, there's a reason why he's Mick Foley's new favorite wrestler. So go find it. Go find go watch him live. Go watch him on YouTube.
Jackman Ochs:Go find him. You're gonna love him too. Thank you guys so much for listening. Jack, thank you for coming by. Thank you, guys.
Brian Hines:Thank you, sir.
Jackman Ochs:Love you, guys.
